Hi,
Anyone out there with AOL subscribers on your SmartList(s) not receiving all your deliveries or maybe not being able to post to your list from AOL?
Thanks and happy holidays!
--Paul T.
--
Hi,
Could anyone suggest what'd be the easiest way to modify the Reply-To: -field so that it'd contain both (1) either the original sender _or_ original Reply-To: and (2) the list address?
This is for special lists where most people sending aren't on the list (small teams handling, e.g., webmaster addresses and the like: replies should go also to others in the team so they know it's been taken care of).
Can it be done simply by modifying rc.custom "reply_to" setting (and if so, how) or do I need to modify some of the scripts?
Any suggestions would be welcome.
At 7:07 AM -0500 12/19/01, Tapani Tarvainen is rumored to have typed:
Could anyone suggest what'd be the easiest way to modify the Reply-To: -field so that it'd contain both (1) either the original sender _or_ original Reply-To: and (2) the list address?
Yuck.
This is for special lists where most people sending aren't on the list (small teams handling, e.g., webmaster addresses and the like: replies should go also to others in the team so they know it's been taken care of).
If these are highly-trained professionals, they should easily be able to handle sending a Bcc: to the "team" without munging the Reply-To: header field; if they aren't and can't, you might want to get more highly-trained staff. And while I'm on the subject, unless you have a few _hundred_ support people who are constantly changing on a day-to-day basis, why are you using a mailing list manager for this purpose? Wouldn't a simple sendmail alias be a whole lot less trouble? Or even a simple set of procmail recipies, if you're absolutely determined to munge header fields until the cows come home? I don't see where SmartList, or _any_ mailing list manager for all that, wouldn't be _extreme_ overkill for such a purpose.
I'd argue that using one of the many web-based support systems would make a whole lot more sense, but since I prefer email to the web, I won't.
Charlie (who's always confused when mailing lists are shoehorned into internal support tasks...shooting mosquitios with elephant guns is always more difficult than using a fly swatter)
On Wed, Dec 19, 2001 at 12:29:40PM -0500, Charlie Summers wrote:
At 7:07 AM -0500 12/19/01, Tapani Tarvainen is rumored to have typed:
Could anyone suggest what'd be the easiest way to modify the Reply-To: -field so that it'd contain both (1) either the original sender _or_ original Reply-To: and (2) the list address?
Yuck.
This is for special lists where most people sending aren't on the list (small teams handling, e.g., webmaster addresses and the like: replies should go also to others in the team so they know it's been taken care of).
If these are highly-trained professionals, they should easily be able to handle sending a Bcc: to the "team" without munging the Reply-To: header field; if they aren't and can't, you might want to get more highly-trained staff.
That was uncalled for. OK, "webmaster" was a poor example, in some cases the people are highly trained in things that have nothing to do with computers (including treating people politely and with respect), and in any case having to add Bcc: (or Cc:) manually every time is a nuisance that tends to be forgotten in a hurry.
And while I'm on the subject, unless you have a few _hundred_ support people who are constantly changing on a day-to-day basis, why are you using a mailing list manager for this purpose?
I'm not -- yet, but since I already have SmartList I thought it'd be the easiest way to accomplish what I need (which includes archiving messages and providing means for selected (but not all) people to get in and out of the list easily).
Wouldn't a simple sendmail alias be a whole lot less trouble? Or even a simple set of procmail recipies, if you're absolutely determined to munge header fields until the cows come home?
Perhaps you could suggest a suitable procmail recipe instead of badmouthing me?
I don't see where SmartList, or _any_ mailing list manager for all that, wouldn't be _extreme_ overkill for such a purpose.
Given that there are several such groups (typically created for projects that last 4-12 months), some of them understand rather little about computers, and I want to delegate their management out (at least let people get out of the list and back again as need be without involving sysadmin), how would you do it?
I'd argue that using one of the many web-based support systems would make a whole lot more sense, but since I prefer email to the web, I won't.
Good. At least we agree on something.
At 4:18 AM -0500 12/20/01, Tapani Tarvainen is rumored to have typed:
Perhaps you could suggest a suitable procmail recipe instead of badmouthing me?
(*sigh*) After spending the last half-hour carefully composing a point-by-point reply designed to suggest alternatives but likely to be misconstrued as flames by those with tender constitutions, let me just suggest you read the man pages and mini-FAQ (in the "How can I forward to many addresses?" section). It's pretty obvious that you don't want to examine the problem, and prefer to consider any comment I make a personal attack, so what's the point in wasting more of both our lives? (There's a vast differrence between suggesting an idea is flawed and saying you are an idiot; had I believed the latter, I would have simply told you that. I didn't, so I didn't. Please try to grasp that.)
I stand by my contention that, based on my limited understanding of your current description of the objectives (which don't appear to be well fleshed out IMHO), SmartList (or any mailing list manager) is NOT the right tool for the job. If you consider this a personal attack, well, there's nothing I can do about it.
You are welcomed and encouraged to use procmail to filter any mail from me into /dev/null (again, see the man pages and mini-FAQ for instructions), to avoid the off-chance that I might inadvertantly "insult" you again, even when responding to someone else.
Charlie
Tapani --
As amusing as the current flames are, I feel I should ask if you have read the FAQ... In particular:
8.8: How do I make replies go to the list instead of to the sender? http://www.hartzler.net/smartlist/SmartList-FAQ.html#Section_8.8
8.9: How can I make replies go to the original sender? http://www.hartzler.net/smartlist/SmartList-FAQ.html#Section_8.9
8.10: Why doesn't putting "Reply-To: $listaddr" in my rc.custom file work for all subscribers? http://www.hartzler.net/smartlist/SmartList-FAQ.html#Section_8.10
Also check out:
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way http://www.tuxedo.org/%7Eesr/faqs/smart-questions.html
If none of this helps, then at least you will have a much stronger foundation for any further discussion. (That last link may help explain the reception you got here regarding your original post.)
Regards,
Pete.
On Thu, 20 Dec 2001, Tapani Tarvainen wrote:
On Wed, Dec 19, 2001 at 12:29:40PM -0500, Charlie Summers wrote:
At 7:07 AM -0500 12/19/01, Tapani Tarvainen is rumored to have typed:
Could anyone suggest what'd be the easiest way to modify the Reply-To: -field so that it'd contain both (1) either the original sender _or_ original Reply-To: and (2) the list address?
[ snip ]
On Thu, Dec 20, 2001 at 08:35:31AM -0500, Peter Hartzler wrote:
As amusing as the current flames are,
Yeah. My apologies to all concerned, I guess I've been working too hard, or something. No excuse, I know, and I have been around long enough that I should've known better. Charlie Summers, feel free to call me an idiot if you like, I deserve it.
I feel I should ask if you have read the FAQ... In particular:
8.8: How do I make replies go to the list instead of to the sender? http://www.hartzler.net/smartlist/SmartList-FAQ.html#Section_8.8
8.9: How can I make replies go to the original sender? http://www.hartzler.net/smartlist/SmartList-FAQ.html#Section_8.9
Yes. I did try
reply_to = "Reply-To: $listaddr,`formail -xFrom:`"
but that does nothing if there's an original Reply-To:, and while this fixes that:
8.10: Why doesn't putting "Reply-To: $listaddr" in my rc.custom file work for all subscribers? http://www.hartzler.net/smartlist/SmartList-FAQ.html#Section_8.10
it loses original Reply-To: (changes it to Old-Reply-To:).
Anyway, I got it working the way I want with
reply_to = "Reply-To: `formail -rtzxTo:`,$listaddr"
combined with the change suggested in 8.10 above.
Thank you all,
I would like a list to show in the email client in the 'from' client:
Jo Blow via MyList or MyList on behalf of Jo Blow
rather than just Jo Blow
(This would be as an alternative to adding the list name to the subject... Now I know all about filtering on headers, but this list is aimed at internet beginners and we can't be spending all of our time explaiing over and over to almost every subscriber how to use their email client. So we need something obvious for them to see that this was a list email .. the 'from' column. I do so grudgingly)
This is what I have tried in the rc.local.s20
# First delete the default headers :0 fhw | formail -I From: -I X-From:
# Provide the new ones :0 fhw | formail -i "X-From: $FROM via $listaddr" \ -i "From: $FROM via $listaddr"
Almost, but not quite right! This is returning the following: X-From: via test@kanggah.com From: via.test@kanggah.com
I have been referencing the manual and FAQ's for 3 hours now, tried many other variables $reply_to, $sender, etc.. with no luck. I can't seem to find the one holding the from info :o( Can anyone help?
And where is that . coming from?
Jo Shea, <a href=" http://kanggah.com "> Mamma Roo herself ... </a>
Paul T. wrote:
-----Original Message----- Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 11:08 AM Subject: AOL email troubles?
Hi,
Anyone out there with AOL subscribers on your SmartList(s) not receiving all your deliveries or maybe not being able to post to your list from AOL?
Thanks and happy holidays!
--Paul T.
This may provide a possible explanation: http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/200201/msg0006 6.html
[...]
I work for a company that delivers large amounts of e-mail for Fortune-1000 companies.
We had a very similar problem with AOL: we started to see many of our messages fail to arrive in AOL mailboxes even though AOL reported they were successfully accepted for delivery.
Sending one or two messages at a time would work flawlessly, but when sending anything larger, some might arrive while many would not.
After a lot of testing, we discovered AOL has some very interesting
policies
regarding email delivery.
In a nutshell, if you deliver more than some number messages to AOL within an a certain timeframe, AOL will accept them for delivery but in actuality, delete them without notice. The metrics AOL uses to decide what should or should not be delivered are not published.
[...]
background: http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/200201/msg0006 1.html
smartlist@lists.rwth-aachen.de
-
Charlie Summers -
CueMan -
Gary Funck -
Jo Shea, founder, kanggah.com -
Peter Hartzler -
Tapani Tarvainen