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Alexander Grümmer wrote:
> Hallo das Kullen hat auch einen Xorp!
Stimmt. Janz verjessen.
> Hast du das besagte Zaubercommando auch bei uns aktiviert weil hier der
> Stream alle 5 min stehen bleibt.
Jetzt ja.
Noch jemand janz ohne Fahrschein?
*In jeder Zeile zwei J*ens
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-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [Xorp-users] join messages not sent out (from IGMP to PIM)
Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 11:38:35 -0800
From: Pavlin Radoslavov <pavlin(a)icir.org>
To: Daniel Sievers <sievers(a)hilton.rwth-aachen.de>
CC: Pavlin Radoslavov <pavlin(a)icir.org>
> There is still another thing I do not understand though:
>
> Our xorp router receives multicast traffic from a cisco 3750 pim-sm
> enabled router. The cisco will send igmp queries to 224.0.0.1 and xorp
> will reply for "all-routers.mcast.net" and "pim-routers.mcast.net", but
> it will never report for the multicast groups joined by clients in the
> LAN behind the xorp router (,it will show the RPs and igmp groups as
> joined though in the shell).
>
> So is this the correct behaviour? Should a pim router decide whether it
Yes, this is the correct behavior. The XORP router replies for the
all-routes and pim-routers groups because it has joined those two
groups.
> forwards multicast traffic to another pim router (and not client!) based
> on pim join status solely, or should xorp always reply to IGMP queries
> from another pim router by reporting all the groups joined on the
> client-side LAN?
Yes, in case of PIM-SM routers, the forwarding is based solely on
the PIM Join status.
> (The reason I'm asking is that the Cisco router will stop forwarding
> traffic after 5 minutes of running xorp. Crafting an igmp report packet
> for a particular multicast group will make it forward traffic again for
> a limited period of time.)
To track the problem, wait until the Cisco router stops forwarding
the traffic, and then check the related state:
1. The PIM Join state inside Cisco
2. The PIM Join state inside XORP
3. The IGMP group state inside XORP.
Pavlin
>
> > To track the problem, wait until the Cisco router stops forwarding
> > the traffic, and then check the related state:
> > 1. The PIM Join state inside Cisco
> > 2. The PIM Join state inside XORP
> > 3. The IGMP group state inside XORP.
> >
>
> Yes, unfortunately all of them look good :)
>
> I believe there might be a bug in the Cisco Software. (it's a Catalyst
> 3750, in the documentation I was able to find what you said about
> PIM-Snooping and it should support it)
>
> Setup is
> LAN <-> xorp DR <-> C3750 <-> RP(xorp) <-> Source
>
> The Cisco has attached other LANs, some of them running xorp, others
> have a bridge between their LAN and the Cisco and thus do not need xorp. (*)
> So maybe the bug even occurs only because of the mixed setup, where the
> C3750 has to perform IGMP Snooping on some, while PIM-Snooping on other
> ports.
>
> The behaviour is weird:
> -After launching xorp, multicast groups will only be received from the
> Cisco for about 5 minutes
> -Crafting an IGMP Join for specific multicast groups will make it send
> again (that specific group only) for 2 minutes or so
>
> -Also it sends IGMP Queries to xorp, but according to the documentation
> the IGMP Querier should be automatically disabled due to our setup (e.g.
> having PIM routers attached)
You could try to run tcpdump on the "xorp DR <-> C3750" and on the
"3750 <-> RP(xorp)" links to see whether the control (PIM and IGMP)
and data traffic is as expected. The extra IGMP Queries are harmless
(modulo the extra traffic if you care about it), but it is important
to verify whether the PIM Snooping is working.
> Guess we should contact Cisco about this....
>
> Thanks again!
> -Daniel
>
>
> (*) Btw, Sammy and Carsten Otto (C-Otto), who told me that you have
> helped them greatly too so far with a whole bunch of mails, are
> administrating networks attached to that same C3750 on our campus network :)
It's a small world. :)
Pavlin
> To track the problem, wait until the Cisco router stops forwarding
> the traffic, and then check the related state:
> 1. The PIM Join state inside Cisco
> 2. The PIM Join state inside XORP
> 3. The IGMP group state inside XORP.
>
Yes, unfortunately all of them look good :)
I believe there might be a bug in the Cisco Software. (it's a Catalyst
3750, in the documentation I was able to find what you said about
PIM-Snooping and it should support it)
Setup is
LAN <-> xorp DR <-> C3750 <-> RP(xorp) <-> Source
The Cisco has attached other LANs, some of them running xorp, others
have a bridge between their LAN and the Cisco and thus do not need xorp. (*)
So maybe the bug even occurs only because of the mixed setup, where the
C3750 has to perform IGMP Snooping on some, while PIM-Snooping on other
ports.
The behaviour is weird:
-After launching xorp, multicast groups will only be received from the
Cisco for about 5 minutes
-Crafting an IGMP Join for specific multicast groups will make it send
again (that specific group only) for 2 minutes or so
-Also it sends IGMP Queries to xorp, but according to the documentation
the IGMP Querier should be automatically disabled due to our setup (e.g.
having PIM routers attached)
Guess we should contact Cisco about this....
Thanks again!
-Daniel
(*) Btw, Sammy and Carsten Otto (C-Otto), who told me that you have
helped them greatly too so far with a whole bunch of mails, are
administrating networks attached to that same C3750 on our campus network :)
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [Xorp-users] join messages not sent out (from IGMP to PIM)
Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 12:04:49 -0800
From: Pavlin Radoslavov <pavlin(a)icir.org>
To: Daniel Sievers <sievers(a)hilton.rwth-aachen.de>
CC: Pavlin Radoslavov <pavlin(a)icir.org>
> Hrmm... and what happens in such a setup:
>
> LAN (with Multicast receivers) <-------> xorp DR <----> PIM-SM Router
> A<----> non-PIM aware Switch <------> PIM-SM Router B
>
>
> How can the non-PIM aware switch perform IGMP Snooping if Router A and B
> communicate through PIM only? It would have to forward all multicast
> traffic, which would be bad if there were other ports on that switch
> with no multicast receivers.
The most efficient solution would be PIM snooping:
ttp://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/product/lan/cat6000/122sx/swcg/snoop…
If the switch is not PIM-aware, then PIM-SM Router A should be the
router that originates IGMP Join messages for each group joined via
PIM-SM. Doing something like this was already discussed on the PIM
mailing list few months ago (see the following email and the
follow-ups):
http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/pim/current/msg00483.html
However, so far it is only an idea and there is no a document to
describe it.
> Wouldn't it be good if xorp had at least an option to forward IGMP
> Reports from the LAN? (and better also reply to IGMP Queries from the
> outside with all groups subscribed to on the inside LAN)
To do something like this would require XORP to implement IGMP
snooping. Implementing IGMP snooping is on our TODO list, but it is
a relatively low priority task and it may take a while until it is
implemented.
> P.S.: Should we take this back to the mailinglist? I missed CCing that
> the last time.
As you wish.
Pavlin
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [Xorp-users] join messages not sent out (from IGMP to PIM)
Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 11:39:24 -0800
From: Pavlin Radoslavov <pavlin(a)icir.org>
To: Daniel Sievers <sievers(a)hilton.rwth-aachen.de>
CC: Pavlin Radoslavov <pavlin(a)icir.org>
> Daniel Sievers wrote:
> > Our xorp router receives multicast traffic from a cisco 3750 pim-sm
> > enabled router. The cisco will send igmp queries to 224.0.0.1 and xorp
> > will reply for "all-routers.mcast.net" and "pim-routers.mcast.net", but
>
> btw, I assume it replies for these 2 groups because the router itself is
> an actual receiver of them (used for bootstrapping info etc.)
Yes.
Pavlin
Hallo,
so habe jetzt auch mal die Liste subscriped ;)
Hier auch gleich mal die erste Frage: Wie ist der stand der Dinge?
Ich habe hier am Montag bis 3 Uhr morgens mit carsten Otto gesessen und
die Firewall vom Kullen für Multicast aufgemacht und xorp intalliert.
Leider mußte wir festellen das alle Wohnheime das selbe Problem haben.
Der Stream bricht immer nach 4 bis 5 Minuten ab ohne das man auch nur
den Hauch einer Meldung im xorp bekommt.
Es scheint so als würde der Cisco Router/Switch die Packete nach 4 bis 5
min nicht mehr schicken.
Gruß Alexander
PS: Die Leute sind hier ganz heiß daraf weil die Kabelqulität in den
Wohnheimen so schlecht ist. Per Unicast wird der ansturm kaum zu
bewältigen sein. ;)
--
Alexander Grümmer
Netzwerk-AG Kullenhof
Hallo!
Ich fasse mal zusammen, was mir bekannt ist.
Halifax: Funktioniert ohne Probleme in beiden Richtungen, seitdem für
den Adressbereich ein eigener RP eingestellt wurde. Hat nach der
XORP-Installation (und richtiger Konfiguration) sofort auch für nur
eingehendes Multicast funktioniert.
Kullen: Geklärt.
Kawo2: IGMP-Probleme intern, mit Außenanbindung keine Probleme (Tests
waren erfolgreich) - mit Bridge.
Schillerstr: Läuft (wie?).
Bärenstr: Läuft (wie?).
Hilton: Afaik das gleiche Problem wie im Kullen.
Hermann: Senden funktioniert (ich kann empfangen), Empfang anscheinend
nicht. Die XORP-Config müssten wir nochmal vergleichen.
Hitnet: Keine Zeit bisher.
Mehr fällt mir gerade nicht ein.
Ciao,
--
Carsten Otto
c-otto(a)gmx.de
www.c-otto.de